Former NATO Commander Wesley Clark urges US to reconsider no-fly zone

The Post Op-Ed Editor Kelly Jane Torrance spoke to former NATO Supreme Allied Commander Wesley Clark by telephone Wednesday. These are excerpts from their conversations.

Q: What moves could the United States make beyond sanctions right now that would help protect Ukraine?

A: The most important move now is for the president to announce Vladimir Putin is a war criminal. Really. This gives enormous diplomatic leverage and a greater incentive to help the campaign. 

Q: Does Putin really care if the president or international bodies declare him a war criminal?

A: Firstly, it can rally European support even more strongly — European governments are all attentive to the concept of war crimes. Secondly, it reinforces Ukraine by supporting President Zelensky. And third, if it goes through, it means the end of Putin as a world leader no matter how this turns out. It’s a very powerful move. Putin doesn’t really care about the money. He does care about his reputation — and so does China. 

Q: NATO seems to be wimping out slightly — they’re saying members, such as Poland, cannot even fly fighter planes to Ukraine through NATO airspace. 

A: This is wrongheaded. This is driven by the United States, and I would urge the United States to reconsider this. Russia does not own the borders of Ukraine. They belong to Ukraine. Ukraine is a nation under threat. And under the United Nations Charter, nations have the right to request assistance for self-defense.

How would the Russians know a fighter plane has been transferred using NATO airspace? How do they know it didn’t fly in over the Black Sea? How do they know it didn’t come in over Belarus? 

Look, for 30 years since the fall of the Berlin Wall and the breakup of the Soviet Union, the United States has operated as the world’s superpower. Americans today don’t recall the stresses and difficulties of the Cold War era. As NATO Secretary General Jens Stoltenberg said, this is the new normal. We are not fighting Iraq. We’re not in Afghanistan. We are against another near-peer competitor that has nuclear weapons. We have to learn and understand how to deal with situations like this. This won’t be the last.

Q: You advocate a no-fly zone? 

A: Absolutely. The airspace belongs to Ukraine. If they ask for help, why can’t we fly airplanes in there? Say, oh, it’s because of the Russians, they might come up and contest it. That’s the Russians’ problem. They’re going to get shot down. Okay, then what? Putin says he’s going to use a nuclear weapon. If we back away from that challenge, if we don’t confront it, this is like a two-pair poker bluff, for incredibly high stakes.

Get the latest updates in the Russia-Ukraine conflict with The Post’s live coverage.

Q: Would Putin use a nuclear weapon?

A: If he was losing, I think he might. And if we think there’s a chance a guy would use a nuclear weapon against us, I guess we just need to give up on the…